Why Workplace Connection Fails — And How Leaders Can Fix It

This is part 1 of 6 of our Workhuman LIVE series. 

In this episode of Relationships at Work, host Russel Lolacher is joined by workplace culture and leadership expert Jason Lauritsen to explore the real obstacles leaders face when trying to build meaningful connections at work. From poor relationship training to fear of feedback, Jason breaks down why so many managers get connection wrong—and what to do about it.

We talk about the role of self-awareness, why cultural misfits suffer in silence, how trust is lost through delegation, and what connection really means in leadership. If you're looking to improve employee experience, boost psychological safety, and become a more human-centered leader, this episode is for you.

🔎 Topics include:

• The difference between relationships and connection
• Why middle managers get scapegoated
• The emotional cost of poor leadership
• The power of one-on-one conversations
• How remote leaders can still build trust and connection

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Transcript

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Russel Lolacher: And sitting here in the middle of the floor of Workhuman LIVE out in Colorado , I'm sitting here with Jason Lauritsen. Hello, Jason.

Jason Lauritsen: Hello. How are you?.

Russel Lolacher: I'm delightful, sir. Thanks for asking. Um, but it's gonna be a busy couple of days. I get to have a quiet moment here with you to talk something we're both equally passionate about, which is basically the importance of relationships in the workplace.

Before I get into any of that, Jason, I have to ask you the question, I ask all of my guests, which is sir. What is your best or worst employee experience?

Jason Lauritsen: Well, I have a good one for you that I think you'll love because it sits at the intersection of the things that that you love to do because it has to do with employee experience, but it also has to do with highlighting how broken leadership is.

And so I was, this is in my last corporate gig. I was actually the head of HR for a fairly sizable, regional organization. And my boss was the CEO and the the CEO, she was pretty conflict, which is, which was always problematic in our relationship because I am not conflict avoidant. So, you know, anytime we'd have need to have any kind of conversation, I'd go right at it. And that was not necessarily our style. And so this was problematic. And as time went on, I'd been there for a while. I, I knew pretty early on joining the organization, I was not a cultural fit. I was a cultural misfit. And so I think that, that, that, the cultural antibodies had been kind of starting to fire up.

I'd been there for a while. But the particular experience I wanna share with you actually as a moment or sort of in time reflects kind of what it was like, especially down the stretch was I, so my boss and I had been kind of at an impasse over some, some things related to my job and related to my future, my role, and I actually at one point tried to tell her that I needed to leave because I'm like, I'm not a cultural fit. You should not have someone that's not a cultural fit, running the culture kind of part of the organization. She just couldn't have it because she couldn't conceive of anybody ever wanting to leave this organization. It was just kind of how they, you came there and you died, so it was kind of one of those environments. So anyway, we'd been back and forth at an impasse. And then I got a a meeting quote on my calendar by the guy that was the CLO at the time. It was kinda my archnemesis. I didn't like him. An older guy, kind of an old, very old school dude that I was constantly pushing and pulling with him. And he put this this meeting on my calendar without any context.

So I showed up to it and I showed up to his office and, and he asked me to close the door, which he rarely ever, and we sat down and he says, he looks at me and he says, well, I'm gonna make up a name. Susan, your boss, gave me this list of things that she wanted me to talk through. Okay. And so he starts going down this list and very literal, she had outsourced providing direct, constructive, critical feedback to her direct reports to my peer on the executive team.

And I looked at him and I said. Like this was at, like, I, this was a moment I had, had enough. And so I looked at him and I said, I said, dude, do you know how much, like, there, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna use the words I actually use. Well, how much BS this is. And I said, you tell my boss the next time she wants to have an f-ing conversation with me, she can do it herself.

And I got up and I walked. That was the beginning of the end. I, I was not there for a whole lot longer after that. We finally, she finally agreed to let me go. I think part ways after that. But yeah, so I, I say that just because I think sometimes we forget that even executives are having their own employee experiences, right?

They are employees and they are also having an experience. Sometimes it's great, sometimes it's not, and if your executives aren't having a great employee experience, guess what? They, they are not going to trickle it down to anybody else. So that, that's what I have for you today.

Russel Lolacher: I appreciate you sharing that. The first thing I thought is you can't delegate everything.

Jason Lauritsen: That's one you should not probably delegate.

Russel Lolacher: What does it say about the relationship you would have with them if they're immediately passing a bot where it's, how, so what have you taken from that experience into your own experiences from that? I'm assuming it didn't happen recently.

Jason Lauritsen: No, this is a long and a time ago.

Russel Lolacher: And look how fresh it is off the top of your head.

Jason Lauritsen: Well, yeah. I mean, it's because it's, it was such an incredible, it's kind of like, it's kinda like if you're driving along the highway and you look over and there's a sea of like white cows, and in the middle of it is an orange cow.

Right? You're gonna remember that because it was so ridiculous. And I'm like, I can't believe, like I, first off, I can't believe they actually did it. Second, I can't believe they did it to me because they knew that I was going to not probably react in a favorable way. And so, I mean, I, I don't, I mean, I don't know what I learned other than I knew, like I already knew that I didn't want to be there.

I think the biggest lesson for me was that like I kind of knew going into that role that I was probably not a cultural fit, but I needed the role. I wanted it on my resume. It was a, it was a promotion, and so I took the job even though I wasn't a cultural fit and I paid for that. Being a cultural misfit is paid for. And I think that's, that's part of, one of, that's, I think probably one of the things that helps me in my, in my work when I'm coaching or teaching leaders and managers, is I always try to remind that, that it's like the mistake there was my boss's fault, right? She hired a cultural misfit into the organization and they put me in a situation that like I could not... anything that was my natural instinct as a leader was the wrong thing to do in that organization. And that sucked. And it sucked like the entire time I was there until the very end. And it wasn't that all of it was bad, but it was just not, none of it was ever comfortable.

None of it was ever terribly fun. It wasn't pleasant. I think we have to remember that, that sometimes, you know, when we make a mishire or we put someone in, or we get someone on our team, it turns out to be a cultural misfit, that's not their fault and they are suffering and it sucks. And the best thing you can do is have a conversation with them to acknowledge it and call it out, and then take some action to let them get to a place where they can be happy and be themselves and perform better.

And then you can find somebody who actually likes your culture and fits and can be more natural in your space. And so that was probably the thing. It's a great story for me to hang on to and keep connected to, because it helps me, I think, bring empathy and compassion and perspective to me, and my work with leaders to help remind them, that the people on the other side, they... like a cultural misfit didn't do that on purpose.

Russel Lolacher: And it's lonely, like to be in this situation, you were not part of the team whether it's your own team or the larger organization. And, and to your point, you're in a different head space because you've already been talking to me for a while saying, I'm, I'm ready to go this. I'm not a fit.

I am not a solution to your culture problem. They're keeping you, they're keeping you. I'm seeing this from other points of view where they've probably been more, maybe they took it more emotionally. Maybe they, it was trauma to them that they feel lonely, that they're feel like an outcast in the organization and they're begging to be let go or other opportunities.

And then the last straw, which could be much more impactful than you just going, oh, this is hilarious. Like some people could be taking it a lot more. This is the last straw I... like, people break down and carry this trauma for years in situations like that, you came from a different place, but that's not always the case.

And leaders need to understand that you're dealing with humans here that are gonna be different based on your relationships, based on how you bring the table.

Jason Lauritsen: And it had a, I mean, it had a profound impact on me. On me, how I did my job. I mean, there, there was like all kinds of ritual effects, both before and after.

I always tell the, I always like the, the punchline for me on this whole thing is I, I'll never forget the day I left there, my last day. Walking outta that office, I'm like, I felt like Andy coming outta Shawshank. Like, it was so beautiful. I feel like I'd been set free. Liberated. It was so amazing. Like just the, the, the shackles. It felt like they fell off walking out of that culture. So I think like I've had a couple of those experiences that really fuel, I think why I do the work that I do today and feel so passionate.

Russel Lolacher: And I love that you hit my Gen X heart right in the right spot with the Shawshank Redemption reference. Thank you so much. I even read the short story by Stephen King. That's how big of a nerd I am. So we're focusing on exactly what we're talking about, which is workplace connection and sort of the obstacles that we need to overcome in the workplace, because we'll talk a lot about how you need to build those connections of trust and psychological safety.

But there are things in the way for us to be able to do that. So I like starting things off with definitions 'cause we don't know what we're talking about until we know what we're talking about. So in your mind, Jason, how would you define workplace connection?

Jason Lauritsen: It's funny that you asked this question because right now, very literally am in the process of putting together a, a research project to go dig in on the steep because I think it's something that is, it is, not well defined. There are, you know, there are definitions as you well know. You could go look at, you know, psychology or you can go look at sort of people that are doing research in academia.

They'd find it all different ways. And I don't, the deeper I get into it, the more I realize there are multiple dimensions to it. There are, and on a very, here's where I'm at, I'll give you my, where I'm at today is that I think that the, that workplace connection is an emotional bond to multiple layers.

There's sort of multiple layers or sort of factors within an organization that you could connect to. So there are kind of the social connections, which is to your coworkers. There is sort of your direct manager connection. So that's kind of the, the person that is most responsible for your work. There is, I think, an, a connection with, I'm gonna call it that the organization more broadly, which is brand. The senior leadership people maybe that you don't know directly, but that you sort of want to feel or me to feel emotionally connected to, to trust and sort of be motivated by it.

And then the piece that I think is important within this is I also think there's an element of connection to self. And so like the degree to which I am, I am connected to who I am in an authentic way has a profound impact on my ability to connect to those other things. And so that's what is emerging for me as I'm digging in on this and I, so I think it's a lot more complicated than just... and most people, when we're talking about it, and even myself when we're talking about connection, we're talking about primarily the social connection and the connection between the individual and manager is oftentimes spent in the domain that you live it. So that's probably where I spend the majority of my time 'cause I also think that's where could usually make the biggest impact.

Russel Lolacher: So would you say relationships are different than connection? Is, is it semantics exercise?

Jason Lauritsen: Yes, yes. They are different. And what I, and this it is, I mean from a semantics note, you have, you know, relationship is in the name of your podcast. On my website, the first thing you see is lead with relationship, right?

So we both use that word. I think usually when we talk about, we use the word relationship, and I won't put words in your mouth, but particularly for me, what I'm coming to realize is that when I say lead with relationship, what I really mean is lead with a connection. Because a relationship just is a, like a, a relationship defines kind of who we are in relation in, can't use relationship to define relationship, but it defines who we are to each other. And so I can have a relationship with someone without having any connection. So I can have a relationship with my boss. I had a relationship with those people I just described in that story. It wasn't a good one and it lacked any kind of meaningful connection. I was very disconnected within that relationship. And so I think usually when we're talking about relationships, what we're saying is we're trying to create connected relationships. Um, and this is complicated. This actually came up 'cause I talk about this a lot with people. I facilitated a retreat last fall where we got into this topic and this whole thing came up. Like, what's the difference between relationship and connection? Are they the same? Are they different? That's where I arrived is, I'm like, no. A relationship is kind of a, a way of describing just who two people or a group of people are to each other. So our relationship might be that we're neighbors. There are good neighbors and there are bad neighbors and there are indifferent neighbors, right?

The degree of connection defines the type of relationship we have, but it doesn't necessarily, I could be and I can feel connected to something that requires no relationship. So I can feel connected to a brand. I don't know if I have a relationship with the brand, but I could certainly feel connected to it.

And so I think I, you know, we'll see. Maybe I do have a, maybe my relationship to the brand is one of emotional connection. I don't know. Again, that does feel like a semantics exercise, but I think it's important, particularly when you start talking about non workplace, because people, when you get into family relationships, it gets really complicated really fast because people will be like, well, I don't have a good relationship with my father or with my, you know, sister or with somebody that's like, I have this really important relationship, but it's, but it is missing connection. And because it's missing connection, then there might be expectations around what that relationship should be. That creates all kinds of other issues then. And so this is a really juicy, like you tapped into a juicy topic that I am... Like, you talk about going full nerd, man.

Russel Lolacher: So what are we getting wrong? What are your old bosses that are delegating responsibilities getting wrong when it comes to building workplace connection?

Jason Lauritsen: There's a lot of things that we are getting wrong. So much of this starts with, I mean, connection. This is the thing that is emerging, that I'm really fascinated at right now is connection is between two people or between two things and the degree to which you can connect fully and authentically with someone else is very dependent on your, the degree to which you are fully and authentically connected with yourself, with your identity.

And I think in that case, I think there's a lot of work that we don't do around being clear about what do we expect in terms of the kind of relationship we are going to foster with people? How are people going to go about doing that? What does a healthy relationship look like in context?

And so we don't create any sort of clarity around those expectations. And because we don't create any clarity, we get messy, uncertain, unclear results. And so I think that's probably where it starts. I think the other thing is we don't scale. We assume this is one of the broadest things, and I would assume that you would agree with us.

I think at the heart of our issue in workplace, you know, we're shocked that we have managers and leaders that don't know how to foster better relationships at work, and guess what? They don't know how to foster good relationships anywhere. We live in a world where, you know, you and I grew up in a time where the, the headlines that was kind of when divorce rate went from, went from whatever it was up to 50, 60% because people finally got tired of living a lie, pretending like they were in a good marriage. And so all of a sudden divorce rates went up. And then that led to all kinds of things. You got whole generation of, you know, Gen X, latchkey kids, which in part that was because our parents were absent to doing other things.

And so we didn't get a lot of relationship, except with our peers. We sort of sorted that out. But like there's. Where do you learn how to be in the food ship? Unless you're, you hit the jackpot with your merits. Nobody's teaching that. We don't teach that in school. We don't teach that anywhere, so then they show up at work. We expect people to be able to do it. So lack of clarity about who we are and how we're going to be in a relationship, and then a lack of just basic relationship skills, I think are the two things.

Russel Lolacher: I'm thinking through this in thinking that time, investment of time could help, but if you don't have the skillset, you can put all the time in the world into your relationship or a connection... but yeah, I was, I was working through this trying to think of like, could relationship be more about time spent? No, it couldn't actually, because to your point, good or bad relationship has no difference based on the investment of, so obstacles to connection are seem to be all around it. So we got training seems to be a huge one, especially in the leadership space.

I mean, you can Google away everybody. There's so much numbers on the number of leaders in, regardless of position, have no leadership training. Where do we start? And you're trying to build that connection, especially with ourselves in order to show up better at work?

Jason Lauritsen: Well even, and I would even add on that even when they do get leadership training, it's often doesn't even start with how to foster both connection. There's no relationship building skills in there. There's some, I shouldn't stir that. Some do. Mine certainly does. So I know there are examples that do, but not all of it.

You can go through leadership training and get all kinds of skills and competencies that don't help you build a better, more authentic relationship with people. So I think there's, yeah. Listen, we're, we're trying to solve a really, really big, problem here and what I have done in my own work, so I'll just say where, where I have retreated to and actually, so what I'm doing here, my session at Workhuman this year is called The Check-in 2.0. And very literally, I'm going to teach a simple, for the entire session, is me sharing a simple four step process for how to have what I call a check-in conversation, which is a mechanism to create a conversation that matters with someone and it, it's not a copy, like it is super simple.

The skills are super simple. You'd still have to practice it, but it's the simplest path I have found to give some... whether it's a manager or a leader or whatever, they don't need a whole bunch of other stuff, if I can just help them get into it. And it's all about basically asking a great question and listening or at the heart of it.

Those are the two key skills, and guess what? Those two key skills are important. Any relationship anywhere. You want better relationship with your kids, ask better questions. Listen, you want a better relationship with your spouse. Ask better questions, listen. Write all of that. And so that's what what I think it comes down to just very simple things.

Remembering that people don't have that context, they don't have that skill. Giving them simple skills that they can put to use right away. They will get positive feedback. It draws people toward them. They go, this feels pretty good. And then I start to realize, you know, when I do this, my job is actually feels a little better. People seem to like it better. They actually seem to do better work. Huh? Maybe there's something here. Then I start building on it and I build on it, and I build on it. And so I think sometimes we overcomplicate. So there's, so it's simple skills, how just to have like at the heart everything is being able to, better relationships, start with better conversations.

Relationships will build one conversation at a time. So if we could start there, that is key. I think through those conversations you do learn. The other thing I would say is like, with leadership to your bigger question, coaching, getting leaders into some one-on-one coaching, a good coach, I think is really valuable because any coaching worth its salt always starts with self-awareness.

Is, it'll be like you gotta figure out where you are and what you're bringing because the thing that's getting in your way most likely is your ego. So let's work on that first. Get you out of the way. 'cause you can't fully show up for someone else unless you are kind of, you turn down the noise, you got your obstacles outta your way.

Russel Lolacher: It's so important to get right away, self-motivated to do that work because a lot of people are put in positions or go through positions of leadership. 'Cause it pays little better. Or because it's an opportunity. 'Cause they're supposed to. But then once they're there, then they're like, but nobody's training this position. You have to go outta your way to do that because you'll just become a part of the problem and part if, if you're not getting that training right out the bat.

Because you can't look to executive to model it because they didn't get any training either.

Jason Lauritsen: Agreed. Agreed. And that's why, again, back to. The empathy is really important is that I am so tired of, of sort of the, the HR industrial complex, blaming middle managers and managers forever, and I'm like, listen, it's not their fault, right?

They, they were really good at something. The company came and offered them a promotion, or they wanted to make some more money to support their family. The only path they had was into people management. So they're like, okay, that's the path, I guess, so I'm gonna apply for that job. I happened to get that job.

I don't know how to do that job. Nobody came and showed me how to do it, and now I'm making a mess of it. And now everybody's blaming me. Like how does that make sense. That we wouldn't make that with like, that's just wouldn't any place else that we would do, you know, think about developing people or how we would promote or what.

That would make no sense. But at work, that's what we do. And so we need to stop blaming them and start equipping them and supporting those people and also making it easy and okay that if you found your way into it, you need more than one... And this is a bigger conversation, but we need to have more career paths for people that don't, like if you don't have a heart for people, you should not be in leadership or management. But that does not mean that you should not be able to get promoted and make more money and get bigger responsibility. It just doesn't always have to involve the careers of other people.

Russel Lolacher: Absolutely, and, and I've always thought that you can have a career path. You can be a great manager. Just don't confuse it with leadership. It's still a very important skill. It's very essential. It's very much needed. There's a lot of executives, they're horrible leaders, but amazing managers because they put out fires. They're serving up, they're doing all that they need to do.

But to your point, I find some of the strongest leaders in the middle management area because they know that that's where they, they have to have the closest relationships. They have to put in the effort every day. They're in the front lines, more or less. They're not elevated by hierarchy where they ha they're forced to do it.

And that's where I get a lot of our listeners is that I don't see that modeled anywhere. What am I supposed to do? Help me. So I, I, I completely hear, and that's why I have the biggest empathy for middle managers, because to your point, they're being blamed for problems that they are arriving into, not causing.

Jason Lauritsen: Right. They get scapegoated for so much of what goes on in the organization and yet they're underequipped. I think it's the hardest job in the company.

Russel Lolacher: So maybe I'm a frustrated middle manager. Maybe I'm a frustrated executive, Jason. Where do I start going, okay. I, I hear this. I don't know how bad I am. I don't know. Where would you recommend, they're not here at Colorado. They're not gonna take your sessions. What would you recommend they do just to get started somewhere? 'cause I, I know a lot of people and they're feeling a little lost.

Jason Lauritsen: Yeah. Well, if, if your organization will provide you with a coach, like if you have the resources to hire a coach. Do it. Take advantage of it because it will like, and, and take your time to find a coach that's a good fit for you and align with your goals and all that. But if your company will provide you a coach, take advantage of that. I think that the second and easiest thing, and this terrifies most managers, but the thing you have to realize is that in most situations, and I, and granted there's always exceptions to the rule, but in most situations, you need to remember your people want you to be successful because you are the most important person in their career, right now.

And so they're cheering for you. They want you to be successful. And so the best thing that you can do is sit down with your people. You can sit down with 'em one-on-one, or you can sit down with them as a group and ask them, what can I do to be a better manager for you? Like just what ideas do you have? How could I, what things could I do?

And, and the easiest thing to do is use a feedforward technique, which is ask them for suggestions or tips or things that you could change in the future as opposed to asking them to critique. Because nobody, that does not feel safe. But if you ask them, what could I do in the future? Or what could we do differently together to create a better impact for you to help improve your experience, to help you perform better at work, to help you feel like you're more successful, what could I do? And then listen and find things that you can take action on and follow through, and then you circle back and you ask again. And you rinse and repeat over and over and over.

Ultimately, you, if you, I don't know if your organization does engagement, employee engagement surveys, that's in essence what an employee engagement survey is supposed to do. It asks you for feedback about your boss, and then your boss is supposed to sit down and have a conversation with you about that feedback. Talk about what you can do differently, take some action, and then circle back for more feedback. It's that simple. That will change everything. You don't need any kind of it like you need no tools, you need no training, you need no nothing. You just need to sit down, ask, listen to what they say, and then find a place you can take action and then check back in to see how it's going, and find what else you can do next. Over, and over and over and over.

Russel Lolacher: I'm gonna bring back something you brought up. I'm so glad you brought up that that you talk about leaders being employees. I talk about that a lot because leaders need leaders and we seem to take leaders and go figure it out.

We'll talk to you later on a performance review or whatever you wanna call it. So many leaders feel like they're others. When they have a team, they're not part of the team, they are the other that's responsible for the team and to report up about the team. They treat themselves like an they, they self silo themselves.

It's, it's a lot. Their team, to your point, is begging for that connection. Yeah. Aching for that sort of one-on-one time. Like I used to do one-on-ones. I had one of the longest, highest retention rates in the organization. I worked at 12 years, same team. And it was built on one-on-ones. That they ran, not me.

Yep. And we talked about everything, but I got to be human with them. And they were telling me stuff they should not tell me, but our relationship. Their performance was astronomically betted based on it. So I love that you're bringing this into it. You are part of this. You are not an other of this, and it's bold mind for you to become a better leader by reaching into that.

Jason Lauritsen: When you invite them to co-create the experience with you, everything changes because now you're in it together, number one. Number two, they have some ownership in it and they are now invested in helping you be successful in managing them better. Why wouldn't you want that? So that the barrier, the barrier. If you're listening right now, I can tell you the barrier is that you are afraid. You're afraid of what they're gonna say. You're afraid that they're going to be critical. And you know what? Maybe you're right. But here's the thing. That feedback and what they're thinking about you as a manager is already there.

It's real. It's just blind to you. You don't know and you can't see it. You can't do anything about it. So sit down, have the conversation, the first time. Brace yourself. Be ready going into it that you might hear some things you're not gonna like. I, I would even sit down and think, write out the most terrible thing that you think someone would say about you or might say about you. Write that out. Prepare for like, just what that might feel like, what you might have to do with that. Prepare yourself for the worst situation because it will not be that bad, and that way you're prepared for the worst. It won't be the worst. Have the conversation. When they give you feedback, the, the cardinal sin, the one thing you can do wrong here is to argue with them. If you get defensive or you argue, or you try to convince them that their feedback or experience is not what it is.

You try to change their mind, you've lost them. So this is an exercise. Ask, listen to understand, take action. That's it. No arguing, no changing minds. No nothing. That's all there is. You can do that. Find the per to view that it will. It's a game changer. Change everything.

Russel Lolacher: And I know I'm gonna wrap it up with this question. I know there's some people listen going, but my team's remote, Jason. They're geographically different. How am I supposed to have that connection with them when they're not in the same room? I know the answer to this, but I'd love to hear what your thoughts.

Jason Lauritsen: Yeah, it makes no difference. Makes no difference. I'm so tired of that too. Like you can, people, you know, foster long distance relationships all the time. You have to, you have, is it harder than being able to walk over and see somebody in person? Yeah, it is. 'Cause you have to be more intentional. You have to be more, you have to be more structured in how you approach that relationship.

But you can have some of the most incredible relationships I've, or conversations I've ever had have been over a video. And so that's not an excuse, that is a crutch that you are using. It's still communication. Use video that's almost the same. It's not the same, but it's almost the same so that you can see 'em and feel 'em and all of that.

Have the conversation. Stop making excuses.

Russel Lolacher: That's a nice little mic drop there, Jason. Thank you so much. I will leave it there. And thanks so much for joining me at WorkHuman.

Jason Lauritsen: Russel, I appreciate it, man. I'm so glad we did it. We pulled it off.

Russel Lolacher: We did, we did. We, we should probably go before they pull away the walls.

They seem to be redecorating around us. So, thank you so much for your time, Jason. Really appreciate it. Looking forward to keeping in touch.

Jason Lauritsen: A pleasure.