Busting Innovation Myths: Leadership Lessons w/ Dr. Sam Adeyemi

In this episode of Relationships at Work, Russel Lolacher sits down with Dr. Sam Adeyemi, CEO of Dr. Sam Adeyemi GLC, global leadership consultant, and author of Shifts: Six Steps to Transform Your Mindset and Elevate Your Leadership. Together, they tackle the myths of innovation and explore what it truly takes to lead transformative change.

Sam shares insights on why innovation isn’t about creating something entirely new but building on existing ideas, the role of leaders in fostering curiosity and psychological safety, and why a collaborative team dynamic is essential for success. Packed with actionable advice and real-world examples, this episode is a must-listen for leaders aiming to align innovation with their unique vision and values.

Discover how to debunk the lone genius myth, embrace failure as part of success, and create environments where innovation thrives. Plus, hear Sam’s powerful personal stories about the risks and rewards of empowering young leaders.

Tune in to learn how to break barriers and lead innovation authentically!

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Transcript

Russel Lolacher: And on the show today, we have Dr. Sam Adeyemi and here is why he is awesome. He's the CEO of Sam Adeyemi GLC, a global leadership consultancy, helping high impact leaders who will shape their corporations and nations. He's an opinion columnist and executive council member for CEO World Magazine and author of various books on leadership, including his latest, which is Shifts, Six Steps to Transform Your Mindset and Elevate Your Leadership.

Anybody listening to the show knows, knows mindset is a big part of the show. He's also a teacher and senior pastor through his ministry and church. And I will try to keep my swearing to a minimum because of it. Hello, Sam. How are you today?

Sam Adeyemi: Hello, Russel. Thank you for having me.

Russel Lolacher: Today we're talking about myths, busting myths when it comes to innovation. And I'm so... oh, there's so many ways I want to look at this, but before we do, Sam, I can't, I'm going to shut up because I've got the question I have to ask you because I ask all of my guests. It is what, sir, is your best or worst employee experience?

Sam Adeyemi: Okay. I'll say my best is the fact that I served on the boss who was keen on empowering young people. When I look back today, because this was 34 years ago. So when I look back today, now seeing the importance of empowering the next generation and how difficult it is for leaders, I have tremendous appreciation for my boss who in my early twenties, I was 22, 23 and he would, if he was invited to speak somewhere and for some reason he could not go, he would send me to go speak, on his behalf, at major conferences. There was one of them, and my younger brother, too, who is less than three years younger than myself, we were serving at the same place and he sent us to a particular conference. When the, and you know, at that time, this was in Nigeria, no cell phones, no way for him to get across the organizers, we just showed up and said, sorry, our boss couldn't make it. We have this letter from him. He said we should represent him. We could see their faces drop. And it was the conference was to be three days. They were shocked and then said, Okay, okay, okay. We'll, we'll, we'll see what happens tonight. We'll see what happens tonight. Then we'll decide what goes on from that.

When they left, I said to my brother, did you hear what they said? Something's got to happen here tonight. Okay. You go first tonight. I'll go tomorrow. And my brother made a, such a fantastic presentation, after the event of that night, their attitude changed completely. Then they were, they were referring to us as, sir.

Thank you, sir. Oh, sir. What would you like, sir? Is there anything we can do for you, sir? You know. But when I look back today, I realize my boss took a risk on me. Oh, he took a risk on us. It was a risk. I'm grateful that we did our part. We made him proud. Uh, so today I can't understand it when somebody says, oh, they're too young or somebody's too young to be I said, no, no you can't tell me that if that is something years ago. Someone could take a risk on me You know, I would like to take a risk on young people now.

Russel Lolacher: I love that. And I would also say it was, I agree, it's a risk, but it must be a calculated risk because he knows you, your leader knew you well enough to trust that you are what, I mean, even if it was a failure, it wouldn't be horrible. You wouldn't misrepresent the organization. So it was, it was absolutely a risk. But as a leader, knowing your people, knowing them, at least that was, there was confidence in that.

Sam Adeyemi: Absolutely. I agree. He had given us, actually, he had taken the small risks before that, right? Giving us smaller opportunities, right? Aha. And we had been learning and honing our skills and so on. So I agree with you. It was a calculated risk. If something failed, I agree it wasn't going to be a complete disaster.

Russel Lolacher: And I, what an amazing learning opportunity as well for a young person to look at rejection in the face, like literally the look on their face because they're so disappointed to have you and not the person they expected. They can't do anything about it. But as a young person seeing that on someone's face, that's something you're going to have to get used to in the work world, in the corporate world, in any, in any world. So to have that opportunity, but in a semi safe space to do it in, that's, that's amazing. That's, I absolutely love that story, Sam. Thank you.

Sam Adeyemi: Thank you, Russel.

Russel Lolacher: So we're busting myths today, Sam. We are going to talk about leading innovation, specifically the myths that are attached to trying to lead innovation. But before we get anywhere, I am a big fan of definitions. I hate talking about things until we are singing from the same song sheet. So before we get into what leading innovation and the myths of it, could you define what you see as innovation and leading innovation.

Sam Adeyemi: So innovation is simply the creative process of bringing ideas together to create new products, new services, new processes, new systems to solve specific problems, right? Now, leading innovation is then the process of influencing one or more people to do that. So it's possible for you to innovate as an individual, but then when you have to lead a team of people to do it, that introduces complexities and that's going to task your leadership ability, your ability to build a team, your ability to inspire them, to motivate them, your ability to move them in the same direction, and perhaps the most important dimension of it is the dynamics within the team. Cause as a leader, you're going to have to pay attention to the dynamics and to influence it positively, because the same way, uh, you have synergy in the team and synergy is a powerful thing that two people, when they walk together, what they'll produce would be far more than the sum of what they will produce if they walked independently. As you add each person to the team, the capacity actually multiplies exponentially. But then it can also work negatively that if the dynamics within the team is negative, then what the team is going to innovate. It's going to be problems.

Russel Lolacher: So you talk about synergy and that, that brings me to trying to understand what are the ingredients for building innovation in a team. You, you've sort of touched on a few there, but I want to get a little bit more concrete.

Sam Adeyemi: I think the first Russel and this speaks to, uh, this podcast, the essence of this podcast, the first is the relationships. The relationships between people, there's the law of buy in in leadership that leaders, that people buy into the leader before they buy into the leader's vision. All the leaders ideas. It's very important. If people love you, then they want to help you to succeed. Okay. If they feel good about you, they want to help you to succeed. Now that everyone has their own genius, they have the capacity for creativity, innovation. They're going to put all of that at your disposal just to help you succeed.

But if they've not bought into you, if they've not bought into one another in the team, then you're going to have a lot of conflict. You'll have people shooting down other people's ideas not because those ideas are not good, but simply because they don't feel good about those people. So the relationships, the quality of relationships, I'll say that's number one.

And then you can move on there to talk about each person's uniqueness, the talents, the gifts, the skills that they bring in and the need for you to allow each person to be free to express themselves, that you don't move the team towards conformity, you move it, you celebrate differences right within the group.

Okay. And then the communication is also important within the team. Like sometimes when I hold strategy meetings or let's say, uh, what we just want to do is to create ideas, I lay down grand rules. There are no bad ideas in this meeting. Okay. No bad idea. So rather than criticize somebody's idea, tell us yours, because sometimes it's the bad idea that actually knocks off the fantastic idea in your head. Okay. So don't shoot down anybody's idea. So the quality of the communication within the team is also very, very important. Those are basic ingredients, the level of competence of the people, then the quality of the people in the room also matters, right?

You've got to bring people who are very good on the job. Very good on their own parts of the job, right? So in each, I say this, the fact that you're the leader does not mean that you've got to be the person with the best ideas. Or that you've got to know everything. No, no. A leader is just a broker of gifts.

They're just a broker, right? The, the real talents are the people on the team. And you just want to make sure you bring the best out of each person and that you collectively bring the best out of the team.

Russel Lolacher: Does the role of a leader in that innovation in fostering and nurturing that innovation and team depend on where they sit in the organization? Cause as you and I both know, leaders are in every part of the organization, frontline to the executive has nothing to do with titles, but when it comes to fostering and nurturing innovation, we're talking, it seems from what you're saying, is the individual in charge of a team, but I'm also going, what about the leader that's in charge of the entire organization?

What's their role in innovation?

Sam Adeyemi: Well, first I'll say strategic vision, strategic vision. So they've got to have the big picture. They've got to see how they've got to see the different parts and to see how the different parts integrate together to achieve the big objective. Because we say that we should not do innovation for the sake of innovation, right?

It's not that you just want to change something and just change something. No, no. Everything's got to be heading in a particular direction. So if somebody is sitting at the top of the organization, that's their own role. It's the ultimate vision, and it's got to be strategic. In other words, they've got to have an intimate knowledge of that vision and an intimate knowledge of the organization and the people in it.

They've got to know its strengths. They've got to know its weaknesses. They've got to have foresight, recognize the opportunities, they've got to sense the dangers, the threats, you know, before they show up. So that with the least amount of investment, the organization can scale rapidly and achieve exponential results.

That's the major thing we want from the person at the top. Secondly, they've got to model the values of the organization. Everything they do has got to be heading in the direction of the vision. At the same time, when it comes to the quality of the organization, they've got to be the model. If you say integrity is important to the achievement of the strategic vision, then the number one person has got to model the integrity, right?

If you say excellence is it, if you say it's excellent customer service, they've got to be the model. And then of course, uh, they've got to then inspire the people who are in the organization and empower them. And this, what you said is important, of course, that innovative ideas can come from anywhere in the organization, from any level.

And people need to know that and they need to be confident enough to express themselves.

Russel Lolacher: And that's where that psychological safety comes in as a cultural norm, not just silos of it as well. If you really want to get innovation to be a part of the organization. I love that you said that they have to represent the values. Cause I love when like curiosity is a value and I'm like, I have never heard that executive ask a single question ever in the history of there, right?

So you have to embody it or people don't know how to operationalize. And what that values actually look like in their, in their face, in the everyday work. It's just a poster on a wall.

Sam Adeyemi: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Russel Lolacher: So you've, you touched on this before I want to get into the myths. I'm kind of curious where organizations get it wrong about innovation. You mentioned that innovation for innovation's sake. I would throw out, people don't, people use it as a buzzword almost too much. Like it's not defined, they just, Oh, it's innovative.

I'm like, no, you just changed your email signature. That's not innovation. That is just a thing you did. So what are organizations getting it wrong? Because we certainly talk about innovation enough.

Sam Adeyemi: Oh, well, I'll say first. You've got to understand the D. N. A. of your organization. So, we describe organizations in two ways when it comes to innovation. Analyzer with innovation and an analyzer without innovation. The analyzer with innovation is the organization that is original, right? They create ideas They test ideas that others in the industry have not even created, right?

The analyzer without, and they succeed with that, the analyzer without innovation is the organization that pays attention to what is going on in the industry, all the new innovations that are coming, and they copy the best. And they are very good at copying. Okay. That's... an organization can succeed with that.

That can be, a strategy, right? With Some organizations have succeeded with that. You just pay attention to the new innovations coming up in the industry. So you've got to look at your organization, look at your track record and see what works best for you. I think that's the starting point and decide on your innovation strategy.

And then, I think then the other dimension is to not be strategic about your innovation. In other words, some organizations don't pay attention to their own unique vision. What they're doing is actually that scanning. Yes. We say that's not bad, but then you're just copying, right? Oh, this is what's successful now.

This is what people are buying into now. Oh, this is what's making the wave now. You copy that, right? And then you watch out. Somebody is succeeding. Another organization is succeeding with something. Then you copy that. Now, somewhere along the line, you're going to get stranded, right? Some of those strategies are not going to work for you because you're not going to understand why this other organization is working with this innovation. Why the innovation, they're being successful with it... because it's, it's like, you just look at a house from the outside and you think you understand how the whole thing works. You can't even see the foundation. You don't have any idea about the design or whatever, and you want to copy it.

So I think, some organizations fail with innovation simply because they're not, strategic about their innovation. Then they're not aligning with their own unique vision. They're just copying for the sake of copy. And then of course, we come back to the dynamics within the organization that some are not paying attention to the dynamics, to the values, but more importantly, the culture.

Sometimes there is a subculture that is developing maybe in the department and they're not paying attention to that subculture until it creates crisis.

Russel Lolacher: It's important for those leaders to also be honest with themselves because a lot of them will see the DNA of an organization and it's not the story they have in their head of what the organization is. So there's this gap between what they think the culture is versus what the culture actually is. So there absolutely has to be that honesty in order if you want to change or unless, like you said, understanding the foundation from which you're building from. But that comes with some really good self awareness, situational awareness, organizational awareness.

Sam Adeyemi: I agree with you Russel. Some organizations bring in a consultant, the consultant conducts a culture audit, and they disagree. The data is tearing them in the face. And they still just want to, they don't want to accept the reality.

Russel Lolacher: But we have an innovative culture, Sam! Consultant, no, you don't. You have so much, you have so many restrictions and roadblocks and no psychological safety. No, no, no. It's one of our values, Sam. It must be an innovative culture.

Let's get into these myths. Let's get into the myths of leading innovation because people have this concept as we've already gotten to know what it is and what it isn't. So you've got, I believe it's four myths that you're, you're working to bust, sir. So what, what are the ones that you would really like to highlight?

Sam Adeyemi: Well, I like to start with, uh, the fact that, you know, there's this myth that innovation simply means what you're doing is the newest thing ever. There's never been anything like it before. I'm sorry. It's a buildup on what others have been doing before. Exactly anything that is entirely new that we've never seen in this world before. It's a buildup, right? Most of the time it's incremental. Sometimes, oh yes, it's out of this world. It's a big jump from where we are. But most of the time is actually a buildup on what we've been doing before. It's like, you look at the pharmaceutical industry. Oh, they came up with, oh, they say, oh, they found the cure for cancer.

And you've got to realize this breakthrough idea is a buildup, must be a buildup on decades of work. So that's the first thing that you don't ignore, uh, the thoughts, the ideas, the processes, the systems, the products, the services that have been there before and just tell yourself and just want to leap, take that big leap like that.

It hardly works like that. It's usually a buildup on what has been there before.

Russel Lolacher: I've always believed that you need to respect legacy. And even with innovation that is change. It might be a change of processes. It might be a change of product, but there's been a journey to get to that point and any leader that suddenly goes and we're veering in 180 directions. Isn't respecting the work done to your point, but also when it's bad, there are workers that have done loopholes and sort of workarounds that has worked for them that they kind of need the respect and I'm trying to think of the right word.

Sort of that acknowledgement that we know it was crappy. This innovation will fix things, but wow, you made it work even though it was crappy. Yeah.

Sam Adeyemi: Exactly. Exactly.

Russel Lolacher: Is there one of the, another myth that I was hearing you speak on was about that it innovation happens organically. People think it just like you, you've mentioned this from your explanation right now is that there is foundation to get to it. But there's a lot of leaders that just like, Oh, it just happens on its own.

Sam Adeyemi: So there are things to do to create the environment for innovation to happen. It just, it's, it doesn't just fall on you. And the starting point is just the fact that you've got to be a learning organization, an organization that encourages curiosity, an organization that allows dissent because some of the biggest changes we've had in our world came out of rebellion, right?

Yeah. It's, it's when you just ask why, why should this continue to be this way? Why should it be this way? Why shouldn't it be this other way? Now, if, if you have an environment where people feel uncomfortable, especially those that hold the positions high up there, if you, if you see it, if you take it personal take it as a personal attack, there's going to be a big issues there.

I come from a culture in Africa where you actually grow up being taught that you don't question elders. I still remember how I learned that at home. My dad would, he would go play lawn tennis every evening and I used to like seeing him in his white shirt and the short, right? And then I would say, Oh, I want to go with you.

And he would say, Hmm. Okay, don't worry. I'll come back for you. And he will go. He would not come back for me. So this particular day I said, I want to go with you. He said, don't worry, I'm coming back for you. I said, you're lying. I just said it straight up like that. You're lying. I just saw my mom's hand swinging in the direction of my face and ducked.

Then she made that statement that, that just hits me hard to say, you don't say that an elder is lying. Right? Now it's a cultural thing. And I found out that people grow into adulthood being afraid to express themselves. I mean, even as adults in an organization. So then as a leader, I have to work against that if I don't want it to create problems within our organization, right?

So when people come in, I have a chat with them and tell them your first six months here are very important. Some of us have been here for over 20 years. We're so close to some things we can't see them anymore. You're just coming in. Whatever you see that you think should be done differently, speak up. Okay. Speak up at the meeting. It doesn't matter if you have some people that are senior to you in position, speak up at the meeting, don't allow anybody to shut you down.

Okay. So, so sometimes leaders are not conscious of the fact that you can come and build innovation on a culture where people can't disagree, where they can't offer contrary opinions or express, even express themselves in the first place. So we need to pay attention to those foundations first. The culture, the values.

The values that are lived out, not the ones written , right? Aha. On the walls. And leaders need to pay attention to that before we then are able to build a culture of innovation.

Russel Lolacher: That reminds me of a story. So I love co ops. I love students coming in and working with teams and the larger organization who are getting that learned experience. The reason I love co op so much is to your point, they don't have that baggage. They're coming in bright eyed and bushy tailed to come in and they're excited.

No jadedness, but they're coming in with fresh eyes. So I was working once with a co op. She was Japanese and she came from a culture that was very much a, you go in, you do your work, you do not question authority. And I had a meeting with her and I talked to her about going, you know what? I look forward to your ideas.

If you think it's dumb, tell us, we don't know. It's the world we've lived in for so long. If you immediately go, why do you do that? Please let us know. And it took a bit of time for her to feel psychologically safe to go, Oh, I, I'm a, I'm literally allowed to do that. You're not just telling me I can, but it's actually a safe place to do it.

Cause she had a laundry list of all the things that we should be doing better. And she was just waiting for that. She didn't know she had permission until there was that relationship to the earlier point where she felt safe that this was a different environment than what she had been used to. And we were able to look at things in a completely innovative way because she brought this perspective in that was so invigorating for the team and that got them excited. They're like, I'd never thought of it like this before. But until she felt a part of the team, she was just coming in to learn for a couple of months to leave, but that's where leadership needs to step in.

Sam Adeyemi: Exactly. So it's, it's to a large extent, leadership has to do with creating the environment. Like I read some time ago about a species of the shark and they said, if you put it in the aquarium, the longest it grows to be is six inches. And however long it may have been in the aquarium, you take it out, throw it in the ocean, it grows into a full shark.

So, which means that the environment limits the development of that shark. And there's something about us humans that is exactly like that. And you just find out in some environments, some work environments, some people. They'll just never be able to realize their potential. And then you put them in another team and they're high flyers, right?

So the leader has to pay attention to the dynamics within the team, the culture. And like I mentioned earlier, the sub culture that may be going in, things may be going in down there that you don't even have an idea about, except you're listening to someone. So what you did Russel with the lady is the thing to do, to get feedback, right? Accurate feedback beyond the ones in the report.

Russel Lolacher: Diversity always comes up when I think of innovation because I just did a podcast about, uh, professionalism and how professionalism is actually a problem because it pushes uniformity as opposed to supporting diversity and respect. So when I think of innovation, I think of diverse ideas and the myth I've heard around innovation is that there's one type of innovation.

There's one definition of innovation. And thou shalt be innovative. Like it is just, this is, this is what it is. Can you bust that myth a bit?

Sam Adeyemi: Oh, yes. I mean, you have that myth too that says innovation is a solo effort. Solo is just to be one person that is a genius, you know, taking on a particular problem. I'm sorry. It hardly ever works that way. Hardly ever. Nature itself teaches us that there are things you just will never be able to do on your own until you cooperate with somebody else.

I mean, like I had to cooperate with my wife for us to get our babies, right? Sodium stays on its own. Chlorine stays on its own. The two of them come together. They form something neither of them could ever believe become on its own. Salt. So it's, it's also the way, uh, innovation works that you actually have got to bring together ideas that are so disparate. So far fetched, right? And it's amazing the way it works because they may seem not to be connected. Then you find out at the end of the day, actually, that they're connected, right? This still brings us back to leadership. That leaders need to operate without prejudice. This is important. And the older we get, the more difficult it is, you know, to, to work without prejudice or bias.

Because even success creates a bias, right? It's like, Oh, I've tested this. This is what's worked for me before. You know, I've been in this scenario before and sometimes you just need to drop that your old scenario because the environment has changed. The tools available have changed. Technology has changed. And all that.

So, a leader's got to be able to allow. that diversity. Diversity is actually the strength off a team. I know you'll have a lot more peace if everybody thinks in the same direction, right? I've had this peculiar scenario where my wife and I on the same team on the same board, and she's so different, right?

And at that time she was the only female on the team and we would be having a discussion and everything would be going so smoothly and so on until she would ask a question. And it's like everything would just crumble like a pack of cards, you know, until she went to attend the course and there they learned about the Belbin test. And the Belbin test measures team personality. So when you find yourself within a team, there's actually a kind of personality that you exhibit. Now, I fall within the group that you call The Plant. We generate the ideas. She falls within the group that you call The Finisher. They have an eye for details.

They, they see the fine details, they cross the T's and so on, and they easily find what's going to go wrong with an idea. So sometimes when she would want to speak at a meeting, my heart would jump to my mouth because you just didn't know what was coming next. If there was going to be a problem, she would be the first to spot it.

But she saved us from a lot of embarrassment. Even she did not understand that it was a gift, right? That it was a talent until she attended that program and ran the course. Because if we, if you have a printed page and you give it to my wife, the first word she would notice is the one that is spelled correctly and incorrectly. And that word could be on the last line. Yet that's where she, she said it was even a source of concern to her. Like she would think, would, would, would people think I'm a bad person? Why is it the, the word that has a mistake that I pick out first, right? So a leader has got to be open without prejudice, without bias, and let people bring the good and awkward perspectives to an issue.

And then bring everything together to move the direct, the team to adopt the best ideas.

Russel Lolacher: The last myth I want to touch on is the one around failure because a lot of organizations will talk about failure and then go, okay, we're going to stop there. It's not working. Move on to the next thing. And not let failure breathe. They see the myth being that failure shows that it's not working. What would you say to that?

Sam Adeyemi: This is a big one, Russel, because we're so averse to pain, so averse to failure, right? Yet, when I think back to when we were in high school, they took us into the laboratories, and whatever we did there, they said, there were experiments, but it does seem like the older we grow, the more we do not want to allow for experimenting. We just expect things to work perfectly the first time.

Now I teach for decades. I've been on the media, radio, TV, teaching people basic principles for success. I, I came to find out that failure is actually not the opposite of success like that. Actually it is failure that leads to success. . Yeah. So that's what happens in the lab. That's what happens with research.

You fail and fail and fail. You don't take it to mean that you failed and you should abandon your cause. You actually take failure as something that moves you closer to success. The more you find out what doesn't work, the more you are closer to finding actually what works. This is important for the attitude in the whole organization.

If an organization reacts violently to mistakes, that's going to send a message across. Except you get it perfectly here. You are better not try it because you're going to be roasted. And then you have the fear of making mistakes, the fear of, you know, of failing. So when you understand how the dynamics between failure and success.

Then you tell people to actually fail faster, right? You make room for people to fail. That there's a famous story about Tom Watson, one of the founders of IBM and how an engineer made a mistake that cost them $600,000. And Tom Watson called the engineer into his office and said, I'm sure you know why I called you, right?

The guy said, of course, to fire me. And Tom Watson said, why should I fire you? I just spent $600,000 training you. Why should I allow you to go to someplace else and let them get the benefit of that experience? I'm sure you won't make the same mistake again, right? So go back to your work and make sure you don't make that kind of a mistake anymore, right?

That that's a powerful perspective to failure that so at an organizational level, at the cultural level, it's not like an organization should allow itself to run into losses, you know, and to fail, but that an organization should at least make some room for experimenting, for trying, and not getting it.

Whoever you are as an executive, you've got to accept you were not born perfect. You were not born a genius. You were not born an expert. How many children actually stand up and walk straight the first time you stand up, hit your bum on the ground and stand again. Even at that, your parents are clapping because even with the failures, you're actually making progress and you're trying it.

So it gives the hope that eventually you will get it right. So I do hope that, organizations will not assume that the ones that have been very successful with innovation, actually, it's because they have experts that get it right the first time. That's a meat. Doesn't work like that. They actually make room for people to experiment and fail a bit.

Russel Lolacher: I appreciate the fact that you were talking about investing in the humans being worth the money because immediately I can hear you talking about, you know, you need to fail to succeed. You need to fail to succeed. And I'm sure there's some executives listening, going, I don't have the budget to fail that often before I have to deliver something. I got, you know, the heat come in the back of my neck that I have to deliver a thing and the quicker I can deliver it, the more cost effective it will be. What do you say to somebody like that?

Sam Adeyemi: Mhm. And I'll just say, you, you find out actually that you may, you may hire very smart people because if you're going to achieve that, you still, you will still spend the money. I promise you, you still spend the money because you'll have a high labor turnover. The likelihood is you're going to have a high labor turnover since you don't have that wide spectrum for allowing people to make mistakes. So exactly. And since you want your work done perfectly, the first time you've got to hire the best. Fantastic. You spend the money, but I promise you, they won't be loyal to you. There's something about you investing in a human that makes them to find a sense of meaning in your work because you've invested in their worth in their essence as a human.

And when they're loyal, I promise you it's not all the time that a bigger pay package motivates someone. They believe in your mission. They believe in you. Uh, if you get that loyalty, you're likely to get better results.

Russel Lolacher: What do you say to an emerging leader? Someone that's maybe not at the top of the organization or, or maybe necessarily leading the team, but they're trying to navigate these myths. They're not a hundred percent sure what the culture is. They're not a hundred percent sure of the, the environment in which they're trying to be innovative.

How do they make informed decisions? They're listening to you talk right now and they're like, okay, I want to avoid these myths. What do I do?

Sam Adeyemi: Thank you, Russel. You know, I run a leadership academy in Nigeria. We've had over 45,000 people come through the school, and we actually give people a little paradigm shifts. I warn people from the beginning, we're going to shift your brain a little bit. Because we're counter cultural in our thinking.

What then happens is if they come from another organization, by the time we're done with them, they have a lot of radical ideas. So some get back, but they are not at the top of the organization. So, and then they say, Oh, this is not what they taught us at DLA. You know, that's our school. They start Leadership Academy.

Oh, this is not what we were taught. This is not what, and if they're not careful, they will find themselves at loggerheads with their bosses. You know, they find themselves in rebellion. So I say, you've got to be really smart. Yes, you get your ideas. How you communicate those ideas to the people at the higher level is very important.

One, I say the average human mind needs about 72 hours to be comfortable with a new idea. Give your boss time to think about those ideas, to brood on them. Two, don't force the ideas on them. Okay? Leave the idea, let them cook it. You are not fully aware of the political dynamics that they need to navigate to be able to execute some of those ideas that you are giving them.

Okay. Let them process it. Thirdly, try and put your ideas down in writing, right? Because things tend to shift when you don't capture them actually in writing. Let there be a record that you pass this idea. Discuss face to face first, then back it up with an email. But then I tell them that as a last resort, sometimes you're dealing with an immediate boss who either is insecure and won't pass your ideas across or would pass your ideas across and own them.

And there'll be no mention that the ideas came from you or something. If you see that over a long period of time, nothing is going on, try and confide in someone else. Who also has influence in the system and can get your ideas across. They need to know you're thinking for the organization. It's important for them to be aware.

Russel Lolacher: It's funny. I've, I mean, I've tried to integrate ideas in, but I also know I'm not the mouth that is the best messenger for some of those ideas. So it's so important to make sure, okay, what baggage do I have? What's my brand within the organization? What's my reputation, good and bad. And maybe if I have innovative ideas, who has more influence on the people I want to influence than I do?

Who are the champions that are, you know, are the right messenger that I have a really close relationship and could be perpetuating that message, even if I don't get to own it, but at least I get to perpetuate it and get to put it into motion. That served me really well because sometimes you have to be humble enough to know you're not you're not the right messenger.

Sam Adeyemi: That's so smart. So smart. I think that would serve all of us generally in life. Just to know that. Yeah. I may be the originator of the idea, but I may not be the best person to say it.

Russel Lolacher: You've had, as you mentioned through, uh, your teachings, you've had a lot of people come through what have, what has been sort of the, one of the biggest aha moments for anyone coming in, coming in with this, as I said, baggage with all these myths and these preconceived notions. And after spending some time with you, what was the thing that sort of like, Oh, I don't need to think like that at all. That is not the right way that I should be approaching this. What triggered that for them?

Sam Adeyemi: Well, I would say it's when I shift people's attention from trying to control what is external to them, to what is internal. I use the illustration of a sailboat and I say it's there on the sea or lake. There's no engine to power it and you need to move it in a particular direction. So I say wisdom tells you, you have no control over the wind, the direction of the wind, the speed of the wind.

So you ask yourself, so what do I have control over? And I say, it's the sail. It's that sail. You focus on that. And that when you turn that sail at a particular angle, the wind that you cannot control actually takes you to where you want to go. So I tell them it's the way life works. Success is first within and then without.

That the things you can really control in this life, your thoughts, your emotions, you focus on those. And it's just amazing. That the other external factors like the economy and the weather and even the president and other people's opinions, one way or the other, they get you in the direction that you want to go.

Russel Lolacher: Oh, I can't think of a better way to end that conversation than understanding you're empowering yourself to move the needle on innovation. Thank you so much for this, Sam. I really, really appreciate your time. I'm not letting you get away though, because one last question I have to ask. So looking at those relationships, which we started this conversation on.

Love that. What's one simple action people can do right now to improve their relationships at work?

Sam Adeyemi: Oh, thank you so much. I would say at the root of it, cultivating empathy. Caring, just taking time to pay attention to the other person, to your boss, to your colleague, right? And to see beyond the tasks, see beyond the work and see them as humans and ask yourself what's going on in their lives. Care about them.

Now, of course you've got to respect your boundaries. And find out how much people are willing to allow you to go. But if you just pay attention to someone, pay attention to their countenance, you know, just pay attention to their lives, pay attention to what's going on. You can at least ask a question.

You're not looking bright today. Is everything okay? If they're willing, then they let you in a little bit more. Because what happens in people's lives outside of work actually affects their lives at work a lot than we realize. So pay attention to people and at least care, genuinely.

Russel Lolacher: That is Dr. Sam. Adeyemi... I was going to get this right and I messed it up at the end. He is a teacher, he is an author and he's the CEO of his own consultancy, helping leaders shape their corporations. Uh, definitely check out his book. It's called Shifts, Six Steps to Transform Your Mindset and Elevate Your Leadership.

Thank you so much for being here,

Sam Adeyemi: Thank you so much for having me, Russel. It's been a great conversation.